Locking Horns

[Deep in the heart]

This is an awesome feature and I think y'all need to bring it to the board. I think I agreed with @CJ Vogel on his points on 2 and 3. But I think it would be a great feature to bring to the board to let us chime in.

[CJ Vogel]

I love the concept of this show and I hope you guys all enjoy it as well!

I will attach the questions we debated this week down below. Make sure to tune in this week as well!

[CJ Vogel]

Topics from this week's Locking Horns:

1. Grade Arch Manning's performance against Ohio State from 1–10 (10 being best).

2. What is the biggest trap game remaining on the Texas schedule?

3. What is the biggest red flag to come out of the win over Ohio State? What is something you saw that you are afraid might bite Texas when they play one of the other top opponents on their schedule?

[CJ Vogel]

 

[Hookem72]

11 minutes ago, CJ Vogel said:

Topics from this week's Locking Horns:

1. Grade Arch Manning's performance against Ohio State from 1–10 (10 being best).

2. What is the biggest trap game remaining on the Texas schedule?

3. What is the biggest red flag to come out of the win over Ohio State? What is something you saw that you are afraid might bite Texas when they play one of the other top opponents on their schedule?

1.  At half 3, 4th quarter 10. Overall 8

2.  Mississippi State 

3.  Turnovers

[Alex Butler]

1 minute ago, Hookem72 said:

1.  At half 3, 4th quarter 10. Overall 8

2.  Mississippi State 

3.  Turnovers

1.  First half 6 second half 9 overall 8. 
2.  Mizzou

3.  Ball security and drops

[nineliveslost]

1. 6.5 too many overthrows and the self-sack 

2. LSU

3. Dropped passes 

 

[Deep in the heart]

31 minutes ago, CJ Vogel said:

I love the concept of this show and I hope you guys all enjoy it as well!

I will attach the questions we debated this week down below. Make sure to tune in this week as well!

I love it man. You and Bobby get after it!

[Deep in the heart]

1. I think a 7 overall. 4th was 10 right. I saw the same missed yards to Mosley as well but Arch didn't get a lot of help from his receivers. 

2. OU. I had this as a loss already and now I think this will be their Superbowl.

3. The first half start. Regardless if Raleek had the ball in the inside or out, the blocking got blown up. Cam was wide open and yes he should've caught that ball but it wasn't a TD because he had to dive for it. Arch has to put it in him. The drops were mental. I think the team is playing emotional and not with emotion the first half until Sark calms them down. Why is that? It happens every big game no matter which player causes it. We have to fix that.

Edited 9 hours ago by Deep in the heart

[Califashorn75]

I am not worried about OU. LSU and Tennessee worry me. 

[DanielOnorato]

52 minutes ago, CJ Vogel said:

Topics from this week's Locking Horns:

1. Grade Arch Manning's performance against Ohio State from 1–10 (10 being best).

2. What is the biggest trap game remaining on the Texas schedule?

3. What is the biggest red flag to come out of the win over Ohio State? What is something you saw that you are afraid might bite Texas when they play one of the other top opponents on their schedule?

I have Arch at an 8.5 - he left some meat on the bone but he was absolutely lights out when you needed him to be against the #1 team in the nation. If they hadn't dropped the ball I think he'd have gone for 300 yards 3 TDS and 0 int but of course crisis precipitated change. Due to the mistakes by his supporting cast he had to be more of a game manager and what we thought may have been a weakness a year ago certainly looked like a strength.

Biggest trap game for me is at Tennessee. Texas has been very solid at home. We saw a lapse in a similar position last year at Florida. You cannot underestimate a freshman QB. Texas fans including myself were thinking DJ Lagway (Lagwe)has not looked good and he has a bum ankle. He set Texas on fire. It was a game of bad bounces from the start with Taaffe unable to cover a fumble that he would have 9 times out of 10. Do not take this visit lightly they will have to play disciplined football all day. 

The biggest red flag for me is ball security. Sark preached about the value of turnover differential all off-season and the importance of taking care of the pill. To come out and turn it over 2 times in the first 5 plays was a major issue. On top of that they fumbled on the goal line prior to the game winning touchdown. Special teams they muffed one. 

A second issue is punt coverage. They need to ensure they keep a player out on a gunner. Teams saw the all 22 where a gunner was left bare ass on Saturday night for Ohio State where if they had balls like Kirby Smart they would have made Texas pay. As well as Texas played in the second half, and I believe had they converted in the first half on plays they normally will, they would have won the game by 10 plus points but they were also against a very predictable Arthur Smith. Complementary football is going to be crucial for any championship contender and Jeff Banks needs to ensure that there are no fake punt conversions against Texas this season. 

Edited 9 hours ago by DanielOnorato

[Bunk Moreland]

I’m a bit baffled by the discussion on the first question. CJ nailed it. Whatever the circumstances (and receiver drops certainly played a MAJOR role), Arch had a pass efficiency rating of 110. That’s really bad. I don’t care that it was against Ohio State—it wasn’t good enough. I don’t think it’s outrageous to give Arch a huge amount of credit for his 4Q performance and leading the comeback while saying that to do so he had to overcome a “C” performance. You can’t just look at how the game ended to assess his overall body of work. Give him a bonus for how he ended it, sure. But to me that boosts him to, say, a 7 or 7.5. 

[ThatHornsGuy87]

Bobby would have made a great lawyer or politician 🤣

[JCrofford]

14 minutes ago, Bunk Moreland said:

I’m a bit baffled by the discussion on the first question. CJ nailed it. Whatever the circumstances (and receiver drops certainly played a MAJOR role), Arch had a pass efficiency rating of 110. That’s really bad. I don’t care that it was against Ohio State—it wasn’t good enough. I don’t think it’s outrageous to give Arch a huge amount of credit for his 4Q performance and leading the comeback while saying that to do so he had to overcome a “C” performance. You can’t just look at how the game ended to assess his overall body of work. Give him a bonus for how he ended it, sure. But to me that boosts him to, say, a 7 or 7.5. 

I agree. Arch ended the game with an incredible quarter of football, but the 1st half was rough. Did he have some great throws here and there, sure, but he also missed (didn't see, or didn't pull the trigger) on way too many plays. When he starts playing consistent ball, this team will be scary.

[f1revo]

It's still unbelievable to me that we didn't take a safety in the portal. Just a brutal roster management mistake there. They let guys who have played a lot of quality snaps for us at other position groups walk this off-season in order to upgrade their positions and then just didn't bother with safety for some reason when we only returned one quality player.

[BurntOrangeMD]

1. A., 6 in the first three quarters. Overthrows and the Self-sack. Get rid of the ball!  ...said half the world. And when you take off running, don't take the hit; get down. 

1. B., 10 in the fourth quarter. 4th and 9, and 4th and 6. If it wasn't for the miscues, the score could easily have been 37 to 20.

2. Florida

3. Early nerves, forced fumbles, and dropped passes. Shout-out to Cam Coleman and Kade Phillips for being at the right place at the right time.

4. There were so many unfortunate situations in the first three quarters. The missed field goal in the fourth quarter helped to balance it out. 

 

Edited 4 hours ago by BurntOrangeMD

[DanielOnorato]

Arch Manning is the best player in America. Watch. 

[AusMOJO]

1. I give Arch an 8. Don't think the early offensive issues were his fault but he does need to go through his progressions a little better. He was slow to see them and find guys. But he led his team to a 4th quarter victory down 21 points over Ohio State. Although he did have some other boneheaded plays like the sack he took in the side line or the pitch he tried to do when he had nowhere to go. Sometimes he just needs to get what he can or get rid of the ball. 

 

2. This one is a bit more tricky. I think @ Missouri is the trap game, because they should have Hardy back by then, it's on the road and right before some really big games with LSU and A&M. 

In saying that I also think Ole Miss could catch us after a RRS.

 

3. How easy at times it is to move the ball on this defense. I've seen some of the film and if Sayin makes some better reads/throws, this would've been a blow out in Ohio States favor. No chance of a come back. I have faith in Muschamp, but it is an issue. Secondary seems to be the biggest issue a long with not many havoc plays. Not to mention how easily they gave up so many 3rd & longs. 

If I had to pick another it would be ball security. you were about an inch within having 4 turnovers in this game. 2 of them would've been back breakers with the Mosley and Niblett fumbles. 

[DanielOnorato]

8 hours ago, Bunk Moreland said:

I’m a bit baffled by the discussion on the first question. CJ nailed it. Whatever the circumstances (and receiver drops certainly played a MAJOR role), Arch had a pass efficiency rating of 110. That’s really bad. I don’t care that it was against Ohio State—it wasn’t good enough. I don’t think it’s outrageous to give Arch a huge amount of credit for his 4Q performance and leading the comeback while saying that to do so he had to overcome a “C” performance. You can’t just look at how the game ended to assess his overall body of work. Give him a bonus for how he ended it, sure. But to me that boosts him to, say, a 7 or 7.5. 

I believe CJ had him at 6 and Bobby had him at 8. If you're leaning more towards 7.5 you'd be giving Bobby the point. 

As a quarterback you are the pulse of the team. When all of the supporting cast stumbled I felt Arch was the consistent solid. He takes care of the football and managed his calls at the line of scrimmage extremely well. He has put to bed most of the criticisms I had a year ago. To manage drives and convert on fourth downs the way he did I think he has been underrated this week. 

[diegozanna20]

9 hours ago, CJ Vogel said:

Topics from this week's Locking Horns:

1. Grade Arch Manning's performance against Ohio State from 1–10 (10 being best).

2. What is the biggest trap game remaining on the Texas schedule?

3. What is the biggest red flag to come out of the win over Ohio State? What is something you saw that you are afraid might bite Texas when they play one of the other top opponents on their schedule?

1.  Arch played an hesitant game. There weren't many if it all egregious decisions besides the sack but he just left a lot of yards on the table and he was either hesistant or not reading the field. I think if you look at just what the tape says you'd give it a 6.5/7 but if you take into account the magnitude of the game, how the game started off and how it ended you'd give it an 8. It's understable to lose confidence after you come out slingin' it and everything seems to go wrong anyway.
2. I think it's Missouri all the way. Good QB play (Although I think Simmons will give us the ball 2+ times), on the road, before a big LSU game...
3. Big time players playing like it. You can't pretend to be a first round pick at WR and drop the ball like that in those type of situations. You have to capitalize on the opportunities you get. You can't pretend to be a top 5 pick at QB and be hesitant with the football or come off of reads too fast when guys are getting open, especially when the OL is giving you all the time you need. You have tobe able play on time in rhythm to be considered worthy of #1 pick, talent and ceiling alone doesn't suffice. As for the defense for the talent we have on the DL I expected a bit more ngl. I think it is a situation where we're still getting used to the scheme but for the talent and depth we have I'd expect to pressure QBs nearly every play and again, I think we have the players to do it they just have to step up. It's not like last year where I worried about self inflicted wounds or not paying attention to details, this year my biggest concern isabout the star players actually playing like it in those big games. If this game is not a huge confidence booster then I don't know what can be a confidence booster.

[diegozanna20]

8 hours ago, Bunk Moreland said:

I’m a bit baffled by the discussion on the first question. CJ nailed it. Whatever the circumstances (and receiver drops certainly played a MAJOR role), Arch had a pass efficiency rating of 110. That’s really bad. I don’t care that it was against Ohio State—it wasn’t good enough. I don’t think it’s outrageous to give Arch a huge amount of credit for his 4Q performance and leading the comeback while saying that to do so he had to overcome a “C” performance. You can’t just look at how the game ended to assess his overall body of work. Give him a bonus for how he ended it, sure. But to me that boosts him to, say, a 7 or 7.5. 

For sure.
Yesterday I watched the QB school breakdown and his evaluation was very simple: "not that great, if I'm being honest." He said that he helped the team come back in the fourth quarter by using his legs, converting the 4th downs and making some really good throws to end the game but he also left a lot on the field and wasn't seeing it well. It's clear for most of the game Arch wasn't reading the field well cause he was coming off of reads too fast and a lot of the time wasn't even giving guys a chance to get open cause he was already at his 3rd read and ready to check down the ball. For most of the game nothing he was doing was on time and in rhythm... he was seeing ghosts.
The good part about this though is that although I think Arch was a lot more rattled than people realize, that didn't make him throw egregious triple coverage balls or force things down the field: Arch recognized that he wasn't seeing the field well and because of it he was hesitant on a lot of throws cause I don't think he trusted his eyes that much.
It might sound silly but that's actually a pretty smart and mature move by Arch... last year being down 20 points even if he wasn't seeing it well Arch would start chucking it down the field... not this year. This year he's a lot more patient.

All of this to say that I think the biggest area for Arch to improve on is confidence and his feet and his eyes/processing matching the plays they're running... you can't be already on the checkdown when your number 1 is yet to look for the ball. During OSU he was rushed but for me it wasn't a thing where he couldn't process a defense or what he was seeing it's jsut that he was rushing through the reads way too fast and his feet weren't in sync.

Edited 47 minutes ago by diegozanna20

[diegozanna20]

9 hours ago, Deep in the heart said:

1. I think a 7 overall. 4th was 10 right. I saw the same missed yards to Mosley

I'm saying this to kind of prove how much a QB is scrutinized more than some other players on the team, even if for this game the criticism on Arch is more than warranted.
Was Mosley clutch to end the game? Sure.
Was he not only sloppy but the reason for quite a lot of bad plays on offense? Also yes, but that's not the guy everyone looks at when the ball is snapped.
So many times on choice routes he just gave Arch no outlet cause he was running sloppy routes.
He was the reason Brown got caught off guard and fumbled the ball.
He also almost fumbled the ball himself it's just that Coleman jumped on it or the game would've been over.

Again, we have a damn good receiving core and incredibly talented guys behind the 3 main guys... it's the start of the year but I gotta be honest, I expected more.
Don't get me wrong, guys were getting open on Saturday and it falls on Arch to throw them the ball but it goes both ways. You can't fumble the ball, you can't drop touchdowns, you can't get driven 5 yards back by a DB on a screen while being 6'2/6'3 200+ pounds, you can't run sloppy and imprecise routes or miss assignments (That also was a thing multiple times on Saturday)

[DanielOnorato]

41 minutes ago, diegozanna20 said:

For sure.
Yesterday I watched the QB school breakdown and his evaluation was very simple: "not that great, if I'm being honest." He said that he helped the team come back in the fourth quarter by using his legs, converting the 4th downs and making some really good throws to end the game but he also left a lot on the field and wasn't seeing it well. It's clear for most of the game Arch wasn't reading the field well cause he was coming off of reads too fast and a lot of the time wasn't even giving guys a chance to get open cause he was already at his 3rd read and ready to check down the ball. For most of the game nothing he was doing was on time and in rhythm... he was seeing ghosts.
The good part about this though is that although I think Arch was a lot more rattled than people realize, that didn't make him throw egregious triple coverage balls or force things down the field: Arch recognized that he wasn't seeing the field well and because of it he was hesitant on a lot of throws cause I don't think he trusted his eyes that much.
It might sound silly but that's actually a pretty smart and mature move by Arch... last year being down 20 points even if he wasn't seeing it well Arch would start chucking it down the field... not this year. This year he's a lot more patient.

All of this to say that I think the biggest area for Arch to improve on is confidence and his feet and his eyes/processing matching the plays they're running... you can't be already on the checkdown when your number 1 is yet to look for the ball. During OSU he was rushed but for me it wasn't a thing where he couldn't process a defense or what he was seeing it's jsut that he was rushing through the reads way too fast and his feet weren't in sync.

Arch didn't seem rattled at all imo. His teammates may have been. He was the steady force and leader. 

[diegozanna20]

10 minutes ago, DanielOnorato said:

Arch didn't seem rattled at all imo. His teammates may have been. He was the steady force and leader. 

That's exactly my point though, he clearly was if you actually look at the film and see how fast he's coming off of reads and how his feet are moving but what I'm saying is that even though he was seeing ghosts (Sark said so) he didn't let that permeate through the team and he didn't let that make him make bad decisions.
I'm saying this as a compliment to Arch actually... if this is what Arch looks like rattled (And he had every right to be rattled after the way we started the game) the rest of the year he can be absolutely scary.